The Half Time Show: A Sassy-Ass Menopause Mindset With Dr. Heather Bartos

The Half Time Show: A Sassy-Ass Menopause Mindset With Dr. Heather Bartos



SPEAKER_1: You’re listening to She Grabs The Mic, and I’m your host, Cole Baker-Bagwell.

SPEAKER_1: Every week, we’ll explore what it means to be happy, present and whole.

SPEAKER_1: You’ll hear from courageous women who are kicking ass in their lives, and leave with actionable tips that you can apply to reset from toxicity, tune into your gold, and live powerfully from the bedroom to the boardroom.

SPEAKER_1: Right now, it’s time to grab your headphones, kick back and relax, and get ready to be inspired.

SPEAKER_1: Welcome, Amazing Ones!

SPEAKER_1: I know that you could be spending this moment right now doing any number of things.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you for being right here!

SPEAKER_1: Every single time you tune in to She Grabs The Mic, you’re saying a hell yes to yourself, yes to your possibilities that are waiting for you to realize, and yes to living authentically.

SPEAKER_1: So way to go you, because that is fire. SPEAKER_1: And on that note, my guest this week is Dr. Heather Bartos.
SPEAKER_1: She is an incredible woman who is absolute fire.

SPEAKER_1: Dr. Heather is considered to be one of the nation’s top experts on menopause, according to a couple of other fire women you may have heard of named Oprah and Maria Shriver.

SPEAKER_1: Her work has been featured in Thrive Global, Glamour, Shape, Women’s Health, and Cosmo just to name a few.

SPEAKER_1: And in addition to being one of the nation’s top menopause experts, this woman is a Reiki master, a mom, an energy healer, a farm girl, a speaker, and the big heart and brain behind Menopause Rocks Mastermind.

SPEAKER_1: The sassy and smart-as-hell woman is disrupting every single thing we’ve been taught about menopause, perimenopause, and post menopause.

SPEAKER_1: Welcome, Dr. Heather.

SPEAKER_1: I am so thrilled that you’re here.

SPEAKER_2: Oh my gosh!
SPEAKER_2: That was so sweet! Thank you.

SPEAKER_2: I’m so happy to be here.

SPEAKER_1: Well, it’s all true.  Every single bit of it’s true.

SPEAKER_2: You never think about that stuff till someone else says it, right?

SPEAKER_1: You sound like a total fire badass, don’t you?
SPEAKER_2: I’m like, who is that person?
SPEAKER_1: That’s you, babe!

SPEAKER_1: And you know what?
SPEAKER_1: I loved you from the second we met because your energy is phenomenally contagious. SPEAKER_1: Your mind is sharp as a tack.
SPEAKER_1: And I absolutely love the work that you’re doing in the world.
SPEAKER_1: So thank you for all of that.
SPEAKER_2: Likewise.
SPEAKER_2: Likewise.
SPEAKER_1: All right, sister.
SPEAKER_1: Here we go.
SPEAKER_1: So I recently read that 1.3 million women hit menopause every single year in this country.

SPEAKER_1: And this week, you and I are talking about flipping the script on menopause, making a big- ass mindset shift to experience the bad-assery of this whole exciting chapter.

SPEAKER_1: And you have been raising the roof on this for moons. SPEAKER_1: So before we dive in, here’s a big question.
SPEAKER_1: Why do you think so many people feel so shit about menopause?

SPEAKER_2: Oh, yeah, you know, that’s a big number of us.

SPEAKER_2: And it’s actually accelerating because the boomers have just kind of gone through it. SPEAKER_2: And now the X-ers are kind of going into it, but the millennials are not far behind.

SPEAKER_2: And I think that what I can say from my own experience is that our mothers did not talk about this time of life.

SPEAKER_2: It was considered un-ladylike, especially for those of us from the South, right? SPEAKER_2: It was not a conversation that women had.

SPEAKER_2: And so your mom may have handed you a box of pads when you turned 13 and say, here you go.

SPEAKER_2: There’s something for your periods, but no one guided us to come out of this crazy kind of journey with reverse puberty.

SPEAKER_2: And so some of this, and I always say, like to say, Gen X-ers, we like to rule the world. SPEAKER_2: We’re just now talking about it because like, what the hell?
SPEAKER_2: Why didn’t no one tell us this was coming?
SPEAKER_2: And I think there was a lot of confusion.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, my mother had a hysterectomy at age 40.
SPEAKER_2: That was the only option available to her.
SPEAKER_2: She had her ovaries taken, everything like that.
SPEAKER_2: And someone handed her a prescription for Premarin, which is estrogen. SPEAKER_2: And they said, bye-bye.

SPEAKER_2: Well, then when she had all these other symptoms, depression, joint pain, can’t sleep, all this, no one had an answer for her.

SPEAKER_2: They just said, oh, you’re depressed.

SPEAKER_2: You’re depressed, honey.

SPEAKER_2: Here’s some antidepressants, which you can now be on for 30 years.

SPEAKER_2: And so there wasn’t anyone putting all the pieces together about what this time of life really felt like.

SPEAKER_2: And so for that reason, I think a lot of us just assume, because our mothers did and our aunts and our grandmothers, that this is crap.

SPEAKER_2: It’s total crap.

SPEAKER_2: But in fact, it’s not.

SPEAKER_1: No, it’s not.

SPEAKER_1: And you know what?

SPEAKER_1: Talking about our mothers, I remember being younger and my mom had a hysterectomy too.

SPEAKER_1: And I remember, God, there were so much anger and mood swings. And I was like, damn, which way is the swing working today?
SPEAKER_1: It was really, really tough to be a young person, a young woman, and witness that. SPEAKER_1: Because I didn’t know what the hell was going on.

SPEAKER_1: Because to your point, she wasn’t talking about it.

SPEAKER_2: They just didn’t talk about it.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, this is like Betty Draper in Mad Men.

SPEAKER_2: You just didn’t talk about those things.

SPEAKER_2: And so, you just kind of silently suffered.

SPEAKER_2: And they’ve done studies about women that were stay-at-home moms in the 60s, 70s, and early 80s.

SPEAKER_2: And the amounts of depression and self-hate and loathing that they had, because they didn’t have an outlet, they didn’t have a tribe, a community, a purpose, nothing like we have today.

SPEAKER_2: And we still think it kind of sucks, but at least we have groups that we can go to. SPEAKER_2: They had nothing.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, no, absolutely, and I mean, I’m so grateful for that.
SPEAKER_1: I have, you know, the women in my tribe, and you’re one of them. We talk about everything.

SPEAKER_1: We talk about, like, dry vaginas. We talk about libido.

SPEAKER_1: You and I have joked about how awesome it would be for women to just go live on a commune together and sit around a fire.

SPEAKER_2: My commune idea, it’s gonna happen someday. SPEAKER_1: Yeah, build it, babe.
SPEAKER_1: You have to build that.
SPEAKER_1: All right.

SPEAKER_1: Let’s set the stage for everyone who’s listening, because you’ve had several She Grabs The Mic moments in your life where you said, you know what, I’m gonna shift gears and I’m gonna do something else.

SPEAKER_1: So I’d really like to talk about the major, very major career decision and transition that you chose to make at 50.

SPEAKER_1: So if you can hit us with the highlights and the why behind your choices, that would be amazing.

SPEAKER_2: Well, you know, I remember when I didn’t know what I was gonna do with my life, you know, back in college, you know, and your parents, it was the 80s, right?

SPEAKER_2: And so your parents were like, you have to pick a job, you know, it was all about Wall Street and briefcases and Ann Taylor suits and all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_2: And I was like, I don’t know what I want to do. SPEAKER_2: I don’t know what I want to do.
SPEAKER_2: So I kind of got out kind of lost.

SPEAKER_2: I was a little bit lost.
SPEAKER_2: I feel like I was lost till I was 50, actually, but I was kind of lost.

SPEAKER_2: And I started a career and I first made a major career change at 28 when I went to medical school.

SPEAKER_2: And I was the oldest woman in my class at 28, although there were men in their 40s. SPEAKER_2: One was a former butcher, true story.
SPEAKER_2: And he had great, he probably went on to be a surgeon.
SPEAKER_2: And so I thought, you know what, I come into this a little bit wiser.

SPEAKER_2: And I think because of that, I was always okay making a pivot. SPEAKER_2: It wasn’t like I was married to this.

SPEAKER_2: I knew that I would probably have, I remember going to this Johnson O’Connor thing when we were younger that was like, you’re supposed to tell you what your skills were in life.

SPEAKER_2: And now, of course, there’s other ones that do that too.

SPEAKER_2: It said that the average person will have four careers in their life.

SPEAKER_2: And so I was like, oh, okay, okay, if you say so.

SPEAKER_2: So you know, I was always prepared to make shifts because someone told me we were going to make shifts.

SPEAKER_2: And so by the time I got to 40, I had decided to leave corporate America, I had been in the Navy.

SPEAKER_2: And I hated it.
SPEAKER_2: I hated every second of it.
SPEAKER_2: And it was like a factory, it was like a little sweatshop of medicine. SPEAKER_1: I cannot imagine you in the Navy.
SPEAKER_1: I just can’t.

SPEAKER_2: Well, the day I got out, I went and got my nails done bright red, because you couldn’t have any kind of uniqueness.

SPEAKER_2: And so that’s where I kind of didn’t do well.

SPEAKER_2: But when I got into corporate medicine, it was even worse because it was just about, it was just about as a sweatshop.

SPEAKER_2: It just was like, go, go, go, go, don’t, doesn’t matter what their name is, just keep going. SPEAKER_2: I was like, this sucks, this really sucks.

SPEAKER_2: And so I, I went and did something that people didn’t do is I went out and just opened my own practice and my husband just like, okay, I’m opening my own place.

SPEAKER_2: He’s like, okay, whatever you say, honey.

SPEAKER_2: And where there we did there, we had like a yoga studio in the office.

SPEAKER_2: We had all this kind of great stuff and I was trying to make it this whole village.

SPEAKER_2: And then we moved.

SPEAKER_2: And then there’s a point and I think it was right around when I was before the pandemic.

SPEAKER_2: Maybe it was pandemic adjacent, I’ll say it was right around that time.

SPEAKER_2: And I realized that I was not loving, I didn’t feel a connection anymore to delivering babies.

SPEAKER_2: And I didn’t feel a connection for the women who weren’t delivering babies, meaning the woman that was 40 plus that was waiting in the waiting room patiently while I had to go out and run into their baby and come back.

SPEAKER_2: Because it all seemed like it was obstetrics heavy. SPEAKER_2: It was always like about the pregnant women.

SPEAKER_2: And the woman over 40 kind of sat there like, what, what the hell am I like, just chop liver?

SPEAKER_2: Like, there’s nothing for me, like, the magazines aren’t for me because someone dumped off a bunch of like, you know, parent child magazines and, you know, and the music or whatever.

SPEAKER_2: And then there’s parents coming out, they’re always hugging and looking at ultrasound pictures and you’re like, well, shit, where do I fit in?

SPEAKER_2: I guess I’m done.

SPEAKER_2: And I looked at these women and I was like, I totally feel this, like, I feel this, like, there’s not a place for you.

SPEAKER_2: There was no place for me.

SPEAKER_2: And so I decided, I was just told my husband to get my four husbands, it’s like, okay.

SPEAKER_2: I said, I’m going to stop delivering babies.

SPEAKER_2: I said, I’m going to take all the babies I have right now.

SPEAKER_2: And when I’m done, I’m done, I’m done.

SPEAKER_2: I said, everyone can deliver a baby.

SPEAKER_2: Well, I mean, a lot of people can deliver a baby, right?

SPEAKER_2: I said, but I want to get more back into the art of medicine and menopause and perimenopausal care hormones require more art.

SPEAKER_2: It’s not black and white.

SPEAKER_2: It’s not you have a baby or you don’t have a baby.

SPEAKER_2: It’s a C-section as a vaginal delivery.

SPEAKER_2: It’s preterm, it’s post-term.

SPEAKER_2: It’s none of that.

SPEAKER_2: It’s this fuzz in the middle.

SPEAKER_2: And I liked the fuzz.

SPEAKER_2: I liked, I did not like Fifty Shades of Gray, but I liked the concept that there was 50 shades of gray.

SPEAKER_2: And I like sitting in the gray where it’s every woman’s a little bit different. SPEAKER_2: So what works for her?
SPEAKER_2: And so, and then this year I gave up surgery.
SPEAKER_2: So I no longer perform hospital surgeries.

SPEAKER_2: And it allowed me to feel authentic and allowed me to finally give care to the women that I

felt needed my care.

SPEAKER_1: I love it.

SPEAKER_1: And you know what?

SPEAKER_1: Every woman who is out there right now listening is like, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_1: Every woman who has sat in that OB office, because I’ve been one of them, who has been like, oh, I’m the old lady in the office, right?

SPEAKER_1: And there are all these young 20 and 30, you know, sometimes early 40 year old women. SPEAKER_1: And it is every single thing that you described.

SPEAKER_1: So I love that, you know, you chose to do something for a population of women that was so abundantly needed.

SPEAKER_1: Oh my God.

SPEAKER_1: So you’ve got this thriving practice in Texas, right?

SPEAKER_1: What have you learned that’s been the most fun thing for you so far?

SPEAKER_2: One is I’m able to read women really quickly now.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, I can see the tears are I mean, I got the tissue box in my hand over to the other woman before it even start for she even knows the first blink is coming.

SPEAKER_2: You know, I when they say, but you know, I’ve tried this and I go, I know, I know, baby, because I’ve been I’ve been there.

SPEAKER_2: It’s almost like there is a collective sigh that happens when someone goes, Yes, I’ve been there.

SPEAKER_2: I know how you feel.

SPEAKER_2: Because I think there are a lot of people I think a lot of women come in, they’re ready for the know the fight the but and I’m like, Okay, a woman came into the other day and she goes, I never started my estrogen and she kind of made this face like I was gonna hit her.

SPEAKER_2: And I said, Okay, baby, what are you feeling? SPEAKER_2: She’s like, Yeah, I think I’m doing okay. SPEAKER_2: I just I didn’t start it.

SPEAKER_2: And she kind of made the big face again.
SPEAKER_2: It’s not on video.
SPEAKER_2: So you can’t see the face.
SPEAKER_2: It’s like I was about to like slapper and I go, that is totally your call. SPEAKER_2: This is your journey.

SPEAKER_2: You have to do what feels great for you, which is what feels different from right for me and for Cole and for everyone else.

SPEAKER_2: Like we have to look at our own journeys.

SPEAKER_2: And she’s like, Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_2: And I was like, did was some other doctor going to hit her?

SPEAKER_2: Like what what’s happening out there is what I wanted to say.

SPEAKER_2: Like, you know, I think women were so afraid that we’re going to be like punished or gaslit or, you know, berated.

SPEAKER_2: And I’m like, that is a really sad statement on medicine, that you can’t feel comfortable coming in and speaking your truth, your voice, whatever.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, and I have that all day long, people will come in for them.

SPEAKER_2: They’ve been to three other offices and no one will do whatever.

SPEAKER_2: And I’m like, was that what you want to do?

SPEAKER_2: I mean, as long as they’re not wanting to like, you know, send up, you know, 3000 milligrams of testosterone up their butt every day.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, we, a lot of it is very flexible. SPEAKER_2: It’s fluid.
SPEAKER_2: It’s very much bespoke.
SPEAKER_2: And that’s what I really like about it now. SPEAKER_1: I love it.

SPEAKER_1: And that’s such an important point that you’re making.

SPEAKER_1: Like it is, it is bespoke bespoke, because we can all share the commonality of being women, but our bodies are so different.

SPEAKER_1: Our chemistry is different.

SPEAKER_1: Our experiences are different, right?

SPEAKER_1: So our needs are different.

SPEAKER_1: Our wants are different.

SPEAKER_1: So the fact that you have created a practice where women can come in, they can be seen, they can be authentic, they can be heard.

SPEAKER_1: Oh, my God, that’s important.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much for that.

SPEAKER_1: And we’re going to talk about your website and put the link to that in the show notes.

SPEAKER_1: But before we move on to tap into your very deep well of wisdom, I think it would be super fun for you and I to share a few outtakes of our own menopause journeys.

SPEAKER_1: So why don’t you take the lead and then I’ll swap you mine. SPEAKER_2: Oh, gosh.

SPEAKER_2: Well, I will say so I and I think Cole, you were at the last one, I do a Menopause Monday webinar every month.

SPEAKER_2: Well, mostly every month when I can get my shit together.

SPEAKER_2: And, you know, sometimes it doesn’t happen and I make no apologies for it.

SPEAKER_2: I’m like, we’re not having one this month, you know.

SPEAKER_2: But the best part is, is that every time I start talking in front of people, I get a hot flash.

SPEAKER_2: At some point, I will literally, even though it’s well controlled every other time, I don’t know whether I just get really excited, the adrenaline, but you can see it on the zoom call all of a sudden.

SPEAKER_2: And all of a sudden I’m red and I’m a fan of myself and I’m just like, oh, sorry, I’ll flash

right now.

SPEAKER_2: And now it’s just become kind of part of this, of the joke like every month.

SPEAKER_2: I’m like, and here’s Heather’s hot flash, rearing its ugly head.

SPEAKER_2: And so it’s really fun to kind of like take these outtakes like you call them and turn them into a moment where you can use it, you know.

SPEAKER_2: And that’s what I say.

SPEAKER_2: I was like, okay, here comes the, I mean, we may get one now because I’m talking to you and I have, you know, microphone and all that.

SPEAKER_2: I may get one and I’ll tell you.
SPEAKER_2: I’ll tell you if I do.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_1: Tell me if you do.
SPEAKER_1: Tell me if you do.
SPEAKER_2: It’s performative hot flashing is what I get.
SPEAKER_2: God help me if I ever am on like a TV show, I’ll be like, red is a beat probably. SPEAKER_2: But just when it happens.

SPEAKER_1: When I had perimenopause, right, there were plenty of days that I felt like I was having this full on out of body experience.

SPEAKER_1: And for me, it was this really major mind trip because I’d been practicing mindfulness and embodiment for like 25 years by that point.

SPEAKER_1: But I realized that my body chemistry was literally changing.

SPEAKER_1: And that affected all of the tools that I had relied on, like my cognition, my ability to be rational and regulate my vibe and my attention span.

SPEAKER_1: And, you know, incidentally, Heather, I think that this is the thing that we’ve referred to as the midlife crisis.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, my God, our body chemistry is changing.

SPEAKER_1: So how could that not affect, you know, our relationships, our careers, like the choices we’ve made?

SPEAKER_1: I mean, we are literally becoming somebody different.

SPEAKER_1: So I remember wanting to learn everything that I could.

SPEAKER_1: And it was so tough because everything that I read was like super depressing and ragey.

SPEAKER_1: And I was getting really lame advice from my gynecologist because I did not have you as my gynecologist then.

SPEAKER_1: I sure as hell wish I had.

SPEAKER_1: And then there were those archaic insights that were coming from women I knew who had already passed what I call the liberation station.

SPEAKER_1: And my body was doing this like nutty professor imitation as I was moming a teenage son and working my ass off in corporate America in a primarily male environment.

SPEAKER_1: And living with my family, living with my family, my husband and my son was really, really hard.

SPEAKER_1: So I made three decisions for myself that I think, as I look back on it, they were just game changers for me.

SPEAKER_1: And I swear, sister, I swear to you, I think they saved me and my family back then.

SPEAKER_1: I shifted my mindset about menopause because I developed this little mantra that you and I have talked about.

SPEAKER_1: And I literally made the t-shirt, burning a new self.

SPEAKER_1: And every single time that I was sitting in a conference room or out at dinner or wherever I was, and I would get a hot flash, I was like, Phoenix rising.

SPEAKER_1: There’s like a layer of my old self that’s burning away.

SPEAKER_1: And there’s a new layer of awesome badassery that is emerging.

SPEAKER_1: And then I refused all the traditional medical remedies.

SPEAKER_1: And I chose exercise, meditation, acupuncture, and I paid really close attention to everything I was putting into my body, which I know you’re a big advocate of as well.

SPEAKER_1: And then I opened communication channels.

SPEAKER_1: Imagine that with my son and my husband. SPEAKER_1: So everyone was on the same page.

SPEAKER_1: And so I wouldn’t have to apologize when I had the out of body experience, like rage fest that I was feeling inside.

SPEAKER_1: And as I said, they were game changers.
SPEAKER_1: And it helped me see menopause as a celebration.
SPEAKER_1: And like the sexiest and most liberating time in my life because my body was back. SPEAKER_1: It was just mine now, right?
SPEAKER_1: It wasn’t going to do anything else for anybody else.
SPEAKER_1: It was just me.

SPEAKER_1: And I thought that was, I don’t know, I just, I think there are so many lessons that, that I learned, but I had to create them because there weren’t, there weren’t resources like you’ve built out there in the world back then.

SPEAKER_2: Well and there’s still, there’s still hard to get resources to every woman out there.

SPEAKER_2: You know, it’s still, it’s still difficult to reach women, especially women of lower socioeconomic status and women that don’t have good access to health care.

SPEAKER_2: It’s, it’s still, there’s still, there’s going to be a split, right?
SPEAKER_2: A dichotomy of where some women have access to a lot of things and some women don’t.

SPEAKER_2: And so that’s what we’re trying to kind of get this out to everybody because you hit it right on the head.

SPEAKER_2: A lot of women don’t don’t in the midst of it, like in the midst of the storm, you can’t see the port, you know, so you’re like, you don’t have enough at that moment to say, this is a stage of life.

SPEAKER_2: You can’t talk yourself out of it, right? SPEAKER_2: For a lot of women, you’re great at that.

SPEAKER_2: And so it’s, it’s trying to teach these skills that you’re talking about, even to women that are just turning 40.

SPEAKER_2: You know, that’s our mid millennials.

SPEAKER_2: And really, you know, it’s our job again, as Gen Xers, because that’s what we do, is to show the next generation to show the upcoming groups what is going to happen.

SPEAKER_2: And to have a plan in place, have your hurricane plan or your tornado plan or your eclipse plan in place prior to it happening.

SPEAKER_2: Because when you’re in the middle of it, you can’t, you can’t do anything about it.

SPEAKER_1: Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_1: There’s like, preparation is just the key to it.

SPEAKER_1: And, and I think that mindset like, you know, I’m a huge advocate of mindset being, being like the determining factor of how we feel and show up in our lives.

SPEAKER_1: And even then, as I reflect on, you know, my my whole chapter, it was hard for me as a person who had the tools, it was really hard sometimes for me to fend off the rage.

SPEAKER_1: So I would just have to leave my house.

SPEAKER_1: And I would just walk or, you know, go up to my bedroom and like scream into the pillow.

SPEAKER_1: Like, I mean, serious rage.

SPEAKER_1: I felt it.

SPEAKER_1: And I was like, Whoa, who is this?

SPEAKER_1: I’ve never felt like this before.

SPEAKER_1: And it was so you know, it was it was tough.

SPEAKER_1: So I really want to acknowledge what you’re saying about there are some women who will have access to information and some women who won’t.

SPEAKER_1: What are you doing about this?
SPEAKER_1: Like, what are some ideas that you have, Dr.
SPEAKER_1: Heather, about making that more equitable so that women have access to this information? SPEAKER_2: Well, you know, it’s, that’s a big project.
SPEAKER_2: It’s a big project.
SPEAKER_2: And one of the things that that we try to get, I’m trying to get out to women and a lot of us

are is, is you don’t have to have an expensive, bougie doctor’s office to get through some of these things.

SPEAKER_2: There are women out there like you and, you know, Elisa Jones and these other women out there that are have been through it.

SPEAKER_2: And even reading a book that says this is how I made it through is information. SPEAKER_2: And books are fantastic.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, I, I’m a book whore, so I love books.
SPEAKER_2: I’m just gonna say it right there.

SPEAKER_2: But, you know, it’s really about reaching women, but also, a short bit of education.

SPEAKER_2: So what currently I’m working on is I’m working on just a short one hour kind of buy as you will class to do before you go to your doctor’s office or if you think you’re having symptoms that has a checklist of symptoms that has all the options of HRT or non-HRT.

SPEAKER_2: So how to talk to your doctor so that they will listen to you.

SPEAKER_2: How to know if you’re being gaslit.

SPEAKER_2: It’s really kind of the intro to this age group.

SPEAKER_2: And we’re trying to make that really affordable so that any woman can pick it up before she goes to her office visit and say, I’m walking in here completely educated and ready to work.

SPEAKER_2: And so that’s what I’m currently kind of working on something really inexpensive. SPEAKER_2: I’m talking like $50 or less that they can just say, here’s my checklist. SPEAKER_2: Here are my options.
SPEAKER_2: This is what I want to do and hand it to your doctor to say, this is what I want. SPEAKER_2: I want labs like this.

SPEAKER_2: I want this.
SPEAKER_2: If they totally blow you off and we find a different doctor. SPEAKER_2: That’s just simple.
SPEAKER_2: You know, it’s nothing harmful about them.

SPEAKER_2: A lot of doctors are not comfortable being in that shades of gray. SPEAKER_2: They like, is it a heart attack?
SPEAKER_2: Is it not a heart attack?
SPEAKER_2: You know, is it a brain tumor?

SPEAKER_2: It’s not a brain tumor.
SPEAKER_2: They don’t like being in that artsy area.

SPEAKER_2: And then, you know, the way that that American medicine has become, it’s is we have to see so many people so quickly just to be able to afford to keep the doors open.

SPEAKER_2: And so I say it’s not your doctor’s fault. SPEAKER_2: It’s just a limitation of American medicine. SPEAKER_2: And so we work around it.
SPEAKER_2: So we work around it.

SPEAKER_2: That’s what we’re so good at this age is we can pivot.
SPEAKER_2: We pivot, we pivot, we pivot, and we just pivot gracefully and we go on to the next area. SPEAKER_2: So that’s what I’m trying to get into women’s hands right now.

SPEAKER_2: We’re also working on the Institute for Women’s Futures, which is going to be a nonprofit group to try to help find a graduate medical education for doctors that are wanting to kind of do what I did, navigate away from the obstetrical space and maybe around midlife, do a fellowship to specifically work in the menopausal space.

SPEAKER_2: That is not currently done.
SPEAKER_2: There is several fellowships in the world of OBGYN.

SPEAKER_2: One of them is a pediatric and adolescent gynecology fellowship, but there’s never been anything for this phase of life and it needs to start happening.

SPEAKER_2: And so we’re working on that right now, trying to get grant funding and everything. SPEAKER_1: I love that.
SPEAKER_1: Thank you.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you for all of that.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you for the tools checklist, for the questions, for helping women get prepared before they go in to talk with their doctor, for envisioning this institute for women that will be wildly different, that does not yet exist.

SPEAKER_1: So thank you for all of that.

SPEAKER_1: I think we have to change the language around menopause.

SPEAKER_1: And there are like the word menopause.

SPEAKER_1: Sister, I cannot even stand the sound of this word because it’s like clinical and I just get the nails on the chalkboard.

SPEAKER_1: And then there are phrases like the transition and the season. SPEAKER_1: I’m like, come on, folks, we can do better than this.
SPEAKER_1: So I mean, good lord, right?
SPEAKER_1: We’ve got to change the language if we want to change the mindset. SPEAKER_1: So what ideas do you have?

SPEAKER_1: I know this is a curveball question, but as you sit here, what could we be calling this? SPEAKER_1: Because firstly, men really have no place in this anyway.
SPEAKER_1: So I don’t know how menopause was created.
SPEAKER_1: I’m sure you do.

SPEAKER_1: But I’m open, so open to new, some new language convention around all of this. SPEAKER_1: And I figured, you know what?
SPEAKER_1: Hey, I’ll ask Dr.
SPEAKER_1: Heather, because she’s one of the nation’s top experts on menopause. SPEAKER_1: Let’s get her thoughts on this.

SPEAKER_2: Well, you know, it was funny, I was in a writing seminar the other day, and we were writing something.

SPEAKER_2: And, and Laura Bell Gray, who’s a great author, she wrote Tough Titties last year was a big seller.

SPEAKER_2: And she said, she goes, I’ve never heard you use the same word twice for vagina. SPEAKER_2: She goes, you always have a different word.
SPEAKER_2: And I said, it is kind of true.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, I’ll make up words all of the cuckoo, the cuckoo, Mrs.

SPEAKER_2: Robinson, the bajoonie, the vagina, the I mean, and so I kind of figure it with menopause.

SPEAKER_2: It’s kind of similar, you know, like, I love the phrase menopositivity, just because I like a good clever pun.

SPEAKER_2: I’m sure someone already owns that.

SPEAKER_2: But I’m kind of unlike you.

SPEAKER_2: I think menopause, menopause comes, of course, from men.

SPEAKER_2: And it says nothing to do with men, but men meaning Greek for for month.

SPEAKER_2: That’s why it’s a menstrual cycle and premenstrual dysphoric.

SPEAKER_2: So it’s it’s monthly is what it means.

SPEAKER_2: And so it’s pausing of the monthlies really.

SPEAKER_2: And it does kind of doesn’t really have a great ring.

SPEAKER_2: I love that in in the Asian cultures, there’s a word don’t even ask me to try to speak Mandarin or Japanese.

SPEAKER_2: But it’s some kind of word that means the second spring. SPEAKER_2: And I always thought that was really pretty.
SPEAKER_2: And I like to call it because you know, I’m a rock and roll girl. SPEAKER_2: So I like to call it the half time show.

SPEAKER_2: So that’s what I will often refer to it as I’m like, this is just that everyone tunes into the half time show right for the Super Bowl.

SPEAKER_2: Who’s singing? SPEAKER_2: Who’s doing this?

SPEAKER_2: Everyone no matter what you’re doing with the rest of the game, I could give a shit about the rest of the game.

SPEAKER_2: I come in for the half time show. SPEAKER_2: So I like to call it that.
SPEAKER_2: But you know, I’ve called it the change.

SPEAKER_2: I’ve called I sometimes I remember I used to have a sweet little Hispanic woman that was probably 80 years old and she only spoke Spanish and she would call it her vagina la fleur.





SPEAKER_2: their kitty cat.


And when she said it really pretty, the guy was that my bad American accent.
And I was like, I looked at the nurse and she goes, she’s calling it her flower.
And I go, well, that’s just so sweet.
And so I knew I could not call it her, you know, juju or anything like that around her. Like I had to refer to her as her as her flower because, and I’ve had women say, I call it all kinds of things.

SPEAKER_2: And so I think that that’s where we probably need to is meet women where they are

SPEAKER_2: I have a good friend who’s working in this space with us and she does sound and voice training for women at this age because you can lose some of your vocal cord ability.

SPEAKER_2: And she bristles at the word menopause because to her, it still means old.  It still means dried up.
SPEAKER_2: And I said, well, what do you like better?
SPEAKER_2: And I said, because you know, Crone was originally part of this transition too.  It was the maiden, the mother, the Crone.

SPEAKER_2: And then I like to always say Disney took that image and just turned it into the evil witch, the evil queen, and you know, handing you an apple to tear out the heart of the young beautiful girl, you know, or, you know, Cruella DeVille, who just killed animals for fur coats.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, that’s kind of what we’ve created the Crone into being.
SPEAKER_2: But the Crone really is the wise woman.
SPEAKER_2: She’s the goddess of wisdom.
SPEAKER_2: And so I kind of just call it something different.
SPEAKER_2: Whenever the mood strikes, I’m just going to kind of see what sticks.

SPEAKER_2: And I think the fun part actually is the different words we can all come up with.

SPEAKER_2: And so my favorite for me is The Half Time Show.

SPEAKER_2: Because I know there’s a whole other half of the game afterwards.

SPEAKER_2: But menopositivity, the change, the transition, they’re all great for the right woman.

SPEAKER_1: I think we should start calling it The Evolution.

SPEAKER_2: I think that’s lovely.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, because think about it, right?

SPEAKER_1: Think about it.

SPEAKER_1: Most women, when they hit this half time show, I love that, by the way, because that’s when all the superstars are there.

SPEAKER_1: And that’s why the money is really spent. It’s about the half time show.  And it’s just always so freakin’ electric!

SPEAKER_1: I love that!

SPEAKER_1: I’m going to call it The Half Time Show.
SPEAKER_1: In fact, I think this podcast name is going to be called The Half Time Show. Thank you for that.

SPEAKER_1: But I also think about evolving or unfolding.

SPEAKER_1: It’s either one of those things just sticks with me.

SPEAKER_1: And it’s because we have typically more time, more choices, more money, can’t get pregnant anymore.

SPEAKER_1: So sex is like free willy out there.

SPEAKER_1: And I think in my experience, and I think about my beautiful tribe of women that are in my life, this is when they’ve hit their, like their wise stride, you know, like the most epic levels of sageness have sort of like started to open up for them.

SPEAKER_1: And I think that’s the joy that you can discover during this whole halftime show.

SPEAKER_1: So I like the word evolution.
SPEAKER_1: I just hate the word menopause, Heather.
SPEAKER_1: I just freakin’ hate it.

SPEAKER_1: For all the reasons that your colleague hates it.

SPEAKER_2: I think it’s almost like, you know, like other words that we don’t say anymore.

SPEAKER_2: You know, is it autism?

SPEAKER_2: No, it’s now neurodivergence.

SPEAKER_2: Again, we take the negative out of it by calling it something else.

SPEAKER_2: Maybe it’s, it’s menstrual divergent.

SPEAKER_2: Hormonally divergent.

SPEAKER_2: I don’t know yet.

SPEAKER_2: But, but there is there is a process now of kind of, of evolving the name into other other names in medicine.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, we used to call it premature ovarian failure.

SPEAKER_2: And, and that was always like, you know, I when I had my first kid at 39, I was an elderly prima gravita.

SPEAKER_2: That’s what the diagnosis actually was.

SPEAKER_2: And so then we kind of turn it into advanced maternal age or sort of premature ovarian failure.

SPEAKER_2: It’s primary ovarian insufficiency.

SPEAKER_2: Now we’re trying to kind of anti-misogynize some of the names.

SPEAKER_2: And it’s slow.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, sometimes I call it POF because that’s what I was trained in.

SPEAKER_2: But I have to say, oh, no, it’s POI now.

SPEAKER_2: It’s insufficiency, not failure.

SPEAKER_2: Because the failure is not part of the woman is that this, you know, we still call it heart failure.

SPEAKER_2: We don’t call it heart insufficiency.

SPEAKER_2: But we like to take away this shame and blame from women’s health.

SPEAKER_2: And we’re trying to do that actively.

SPEAKER_1: Why don’t we just call it the revolution?

SPEAKER_1: Like, because it is a revolution.

SPEAKER_2: Yeah.

SPEAKER_1: Yeah, revolution, evolution, like, like something that’s empowering.

SPEAKER_1: Because as we think about mindset, and we’re going to dig into that part here in just a minute, mindset, like, you know, you and I could be in the same experience, right?

SPEAKER_1: We could see a car accident, for instance, in front of us.

SPEAKER_1: And if my mindset was, you know, focused on like doom and gloom, I would report what I saw as, Oh, my God, I saw the worst thing today, like huge drama field, right?

SPEAKER_1: Everything was terrible.
SPEAKER_1: Everyone was dead, bloody, blah, blah.

SPEAKER_1: But now you could have a very optimistic mindset and say, You know what? We saw a little bump, a couple cars like had a little situation.
SPEAKER_1: Everybody walked away.
SPEAKER_1: They were fine.

SPEAKER_1: No big deal.

SPEAKER_1: So mindset determines so much for us about how we feel about ourselves, how we navigate the world.

SPEAKER_1: So I think that as we search for the possibility of a new name for this whole thing that we experience, this changing chemistry that we experience universally as women, I think it’s got to be something that’s really empowering.

SPEAKER_1: Like, again, I love The Half Time Show.

SPEAKER_1: Let’s have a revolution during The Half Time Show.

SPEAKER_2: Well, Tracy Chapman sang about that in our time talking about a revolution.

SPEAKER_2: You know, it really could be our theme song.

SPEAKER_1: Oh, my God.

SPEAKER_1: And I wonder if that’s what Tracy meant by that song.

SPEAKER_1: But you know what, it could totally apply.

SPEAKER_1: You got that.

SPEAKER_1: All right.

SPEAKER_1: So let’s talk more about mindset.

SPEAKER_1: What are the biggest mindset opportunities that you see in your infinite wisdom?

SPEAKER_1: As you think about all your research and the women that you support through your work?

SPEAKER_1: Like, what do you see as possibilities that are not being captured right now by women with regard to mindset about The Half Time Show?

SPEAKER_2: Well, it is.

SPEAKER_2: It’s interesting because I opened a community, a little free community on Facebook back in January.

SPEAKER_2: And I was like, Oh, we’ll have a little community page and I’ll share in there some little wisdom and insights and you know, little tips and tricks and all this kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_2: And I opened it up to women all around the United States and Canada.

SPEAKER_2: And you know, my my website is Menopause Rocks because I’m a huge rock and roll fan and you know, it’s my generation.

SPEAKER_2: And I had I don’t know how many women that said you spelled sucks wrong.

SPEAKER_2: They would put this or I had a thing about smashing the patriarchy and they were like, Oh, you’re a progressive blue liberal, whatever.

SPEAKER_2: I was like, Oh my gosh, I was like, there are a lot of women out there who who just want to be miserable in this time of life and who are happy to make others too.

SPEAKER_2: And I joke that that’s probably how the Karen was born.

SPEAKER_2: She probably needs a bunch of mindset work and maybe some hormones to get through her this phase of life.

SPEAKER_2: But you know, it’s it’s it’s, you know, and I heard Viola Davis, who I absolutely adore.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, I, the woman king is, I mean, the fact that she did that in menopause is pretty badass.

SPEAKER_2: And she was on Fallon or one of those guys and she was talking about how menopause sucked so bad.

SPEAKER_2: And I was like, Oh, please don’t say that. SPEAKER_2: Please don’t say that on TV.

SPEAKER_2: Because even if it did, we don’t want to always just go there, especially for a woman that is seen as a leader, especially as a woman of color who’s seen as a leader in the community.

SPEAKER_2: We want to really say, you know, there it had its moments. SPEAKER_2: It really was not good.
SPEAKER_2: But I found these ways to get out of it.
SPEAKER_2: And that’s where I think that we focus so much on what sucks about it.

SPEAKER_2: As women like to point out, you spelled sucks wrong. SPEAKER_2: And I’m like, No, I did not move along. SPEAKER_2: Move along little baby.
SPEAKER_2: You don’t have to make a comment.

SPEAKER_2: If you don’t like you just leave.

SPEAKER_2: Why do you stop and make a comment?

SPEAKER_2: Because they’re angry, Heather.

SPEAKER_2: One sent me a DM that my 14 year old daughter read and said like, Fuck you or something like that.

SPEAKER_1: I go, Oh my God.

SPEAKER_2: She goes, Mama, you can’t you can’t listen to the haters.

SPEAKER_2: And I was like, Oh my God, my 14 year old is telling me this.

SPEAKER_2: Like I go, I’m not.

SPEAKER_2: And then I was like, Why is she so mean?

SPEAKER_2: Why is this girl so mean to me?

SPEAKER_2: I didn’t do anything to her.

SPEAKER_2: You know, it’s still the you know, the high school girl.

SPEAKER_2: He’s like, Why are you so rude?

SPEAKER_2: And so really, it’s a lot about you know, what I wear a necklace and we’ve never seen each other in person.

SPEAKER_2: But I wear a necklace on my neck at all times. SPEAKER_2: It’s always there.
SPEAKER_2: And it’s just a little scribble cursive that says love on it. SPEAKER_2: And to me, I touch it about 1000 times a day.

SPEAKER_2: I’m always playing with it.

SPEAKER_2: And I’m doing that because I need to remind myself to operate out of a belief of love at all times.

SPEAKER_2: And as menopausal women, what we are now is we are sacred creators. SPEAKER_2: This is what our purpose is.
SPEAKER_2: And so I try to explain this to some women and they don’t get it.  And that’s okay.

SPEAKER_2: There’s room for everyone at the table when they’re ready to eat.

SPEAKER_2: And so whenever someone’s like that, I just try to kind of feel love and love towards them.

SPEAKER_2: And if someone’s having a bad day, I’m like, sounds like you’re really having a bad day.

SPEAKER_2: What’s going on?

SPEAKER_2: And I find that that tends to disarm myself, right?

SPEAKER_2: And also disarms them.

SPEAKER_2: Because if we have the mindset of love, and that’s what we’re here to do, you know, there’s five other species of mammals that go through menopause besides human women.

SPEAKER_2: And they’re all whales.

SPEAKER_2: They’re all whales, which we also call the dragons of the sea, right?

SPEAKER_2: And the post-menopausal orcas, who we all know orcas are badasses.

SPEAKER_2: They found 90-year-old women, female orcas, that are in the pod to protect the pod, to be there for the pod.

SPEAKER_2: They serve no breeding purpose because they’re done with that. SPEAKER_2: And they are there really to protect the young males from attacks.

SPEAKER_2: And because what they do is they kind of dowry off, like the young, you know, women go to another pod, the females go to another pod, and so the males stay in the pod.

SPEAKER_2: And so they are there to protect the males because it’s protecting the lineage.

SPEAKER_2: And so when you think about that, that now we’re in a role of divine creator, divine protector, like divine artistry, it doesn’t have changed the feel of it a little bit to something of something of greater magnitude.

SPEAKER_2: I always like to joke, it’s no bleeding, no breeding.

SPEAKER_2: That’s like my little mantra.

SPEAKER_2: Menopause is great because there’s no bleeding, no breeding.

SPEAKER_2: And, and so you’re right, like it’s really just this is for once your body is your own and with no other ties to anything else.

SPEAKER_2: It’s just there for you.
SPEAKER_2: It must be what men feel like a lot, but I’ve never been a man, so I don’t know.

SPEAKER_2: But you know that they don’t have to worry about getting knocked up or not getting knocked up and they want to be knocked up.

SPEAKER_2: You know, I mean, it’s just this report or having a period or month and what if I bleed through my clothes and into the car and if I don’t have pads or pads so expensive these days.

SPEAKER_2: Now the thinks panties have PFOS in them or whatever and so now they have forever chemicals and we’re all going to get vaginal cancer.

SPEAKER_2: I mean, it’s nonstop the assault on reproductive women and so it’s so nice to be past that. SPEAKER_1: No shit.
SPEAKER_1: You know what?
SPEAKER_1: I remember those days of tampons and pads and and cramps.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, you know, I throw a clot out of my body that would like fit in the palm of my hand.

SPEAKER_1: And oh my god, it was friggin terrible.

SPEAKER_1: So so for everyone listening who is 20, 30, early 40s, not yet knocking on the door of the half time show to become a, you know, a sacred creator or a divine artist.

SPEAKER_1: Here’s what I want you to know.

SPEAKER_1: Menopause, in my experience, was way easier than the, what, 30 something years of periods that I had.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, I had a period till I was 42 before I got uterine ablation and it was, it just sucked. SPEAKER_1: It knocked me out every single month, Heather.
SPEAKER_1: It was, it was terrible.
SPEAKER_1: And that’s what I mean.

SPEAKER_1: Like, that’s why I call this like the liberation station, right? SPEAKER_1: Because there’s no more of that.

SPEAKER_1: You don’t have to worry about being out or wearing like sassy white jeans or, you know, being in the middle of a conference and bleeding all over yourself or feeling horrible, waking up with like, you know, blood on your sheets or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_1: Like, it’s just, it’s just so much easier from that respect. SPEAKER_1: And I do want to acknowledge though, right? SPEAKER_1: With this change of chemistry, there is a change in mood. SPEAKER_1: There is a change.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, you know, this and cognitive function. SPEAKER_1: I mean, we’ve got all of that going.

SPEAKER_1: So I think the other thing that was super helpful for me was talking with my tribe of women about that.

SPEAKER_1: Like my Gen X women talking with them and saying, do you feel this? SPEAKER_1: Like, do you feel like you’re going like a little nut some days? SPEAKER_1: Are you leaving your phone in the refrigerator?
SPEAKER_1: You know, what’s happening for you?

SPEAKER_1: And it was so comforting to have to have just those those super candid conversations and not hide or feel shame like our mothers did, you know, to your point or just they just ignored it, washed it away.

SPEAKER_1: So I’d love to hear your thoughts on the biggest narratives that society is telling women about menopause and how you think they need to be changed so that women can actually really feel a lot of self love and acceptance as they embrace the halftime show.

SPEAKER_2: Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_2: And it’s interesting because I have studied menopause in many cultures around the world. SPEAKER_2: In fact, I think I did TikToks on these different cultures.

SPEAKER_2: And in menopause is the worst, meaning there’s the most symptoms and women feel about the worst and hate it and that all the bad feelings that go with it, the most in the Western European and North American countries.

SPEAKER_2: If you look at Asian cultures, and that would include all the way over to like India, China, Japan, they are not youth based cultures.

SPEAKER_2: So they respect elders over there.

SPEAKER_2: They respect age.

SPEAKER_2: And so menopause is seen as almost like to graduation into that next phase of life.

SPEAKER_2: The Mayan culture is a big one.

SPEAKER_2: And people don’t really talk about the Mayan culture anymore.

SPEAKER_2: But the Mayans believe that women bled out their wisdom every month when they had periods.

SPEAKER_2: So women stop having periods, all of a sudden they are now equal to men in terms of their wisdom.

SPEAKER_2: Now we know that we were way better than the men to begin with.

SPEAKER_2: But that’s the culture.

SPEAKER_2: And so we’ll work with it.

SPEAKER_2: So women look forward to this time in a lot of cultures.

SPEAKER_2: Women in the Middle East, they finally don’t have to worry about not touching men during this time.

SPEAKER_2: If they’re bleeding, they can’t go into certain places.

SPEAKER_2: And so now they can actually in some religious ceremonies, they can actually be present for some of these things because they’re no longer impure or unclean because they’re bleeding.

SPEAKER_2: And my God, those period huts and like Nepal and stuff, is that not the stuff of


SPEAKER_2: What about that girl that got, she got killed by a cobra in one of those?

SPEAKER_2: It’s like my worst fear.

SPEAKER_2: I’m bleeding in a hut in Nepal and get bit by a cobra.

SPEAKER_2: If there was a shark and a clown in there, I’d be, I’m dead.

SPEAKER_2: I’m just dead.

SPEAKER_2: Like I can’t do it.

SPEAKER_2: And so the narrative in this country is, is that our menopause is suck more one because there’s a global or a continental mindset of we are a youth-based culture.

SPEAKER_2: We value youth.
SPEAKER_2: That’s why everyone’s going out and getting filler and Botox. SPEAKER_2: And don’t get me wrong.
SPEAKER_2: I love a good Botox session.
SPEAKER_2: I love it.
SPEAKER_2: But you know, when we have women like JLo, they’re like, she doesn’t age. SPEAKER_2: She doesn’t age.
SPEAKER_2: Well, I know JLo is doing some stuff.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, we all know she is.
SPEAKER_2: She can lie all she wants to.
SPEAKER_1: She looks so freaking amazing.
SPEAKER_2: She looks great.
SPEAKER_2: But she has a team.
SPEAKER_2: She has a team that makes JLo JLo.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.

SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: I don’t have a team.
SPEAKER_2: Do you have a team?
SPEAKER_2: I’m lucky if I am on someone else’s team, really, just helping them out.

SPEAKER_2: So when we start looking at the mindset narrative is that somehow we’re dried up, crusty, old and used up at this age.


SPEAKER_2: main actresses won an Oscar.


And so what I love to do is I love to look at the women that are killing it. 50 plus.
Like find your icon.
You know, I was watching a movie the other night.

It was a terrible movie.

Gunpowder milkshake came out a few years ago.

It’s on Netflix.

I don’t own any stock in it.

But I mean, it was not a great movie, but it was so wonderful to see because three of the that were assassins were Angela Bassett, who’s 60 plus, Michelle Yeoh, who’s 60 plus and

And Carla Gugino, who’s or Gugino or however you say her name. Sorry, Carla.
And it’s she’s at least in her mid 50s.
And they were all playing assassins.

And I was like, Oh my gosh, these are badass women.

to put more women in movies like this, then we start to kind of start to gently change the narrative of, you know, it’s going to take a generation or so that this is actually great.

So the more women that we see, you know, when Hollywood starts to catch up and starts

SPEAKER_2: We look at older women.

SPEAKER_2: Angela Lansbury, hell, she was in Mary Poppins Returns singing at like 93. SPEAKER_2: And I was like, I want to part Julie Andrews is still acting at like 89. SPEAKER_2: I mean, Jane Fonda, these women are still and yes, have they had some more time? SPEAKER_2: Maybe I don’t know.

SPEAKER_2: But but they’re still Rita Moreno was in frickin West Side Story at 90 something and she’s still on the red carpet.

SPEAKER_2: And yes, they have help.

SPEAKER_2: They have teams that help them look good.

SPEAKER_2: But but for the most part, it’s how they feel about themselves.

SPEAKER_2: Joan Collins still dating like man 50 years younger than herself.

SPEAKER_1: Cuckoo Coochoo, Mrs.

SPEAKER_1: Robinson.

SPEAKER_1: There’s the Cuckoo Coochoo, right?

SPEAKER_2: There’s Cuckoo Coochoo, Mrs.

SPEAKER_2: Robinson.

SPEAKER_1: So that’s mindset and like as you’re naming off these women, Emma Thompson, Diane Keaton, those are my top two.


SPEAKER_1: And because they are so real and owning owning all that they are, they’re not trying to, you know, wind back the hands of time.

SPEAKER_1: They’re like, man, this is where I am.
SPEAKER_1: And it’s a friggin privilege.
SPEAKER_1: And I love that.
SPEAKER_1: And I think that’s a huge opportunity.
SPEAKER_1: I mean, it’s so interesting what you’ve just shared about the cultures and how in, you know,

North America and in Europe, we really have the worst mindset about The Half Time Show and how in these other countries, it’s really celebrated.

SPEAKER_1: Like women are stepping into their sageness and revered as that by society. SPEAKER_1: So I think that’s a huge opportunity for us in this country.
SPEAKER_1: I don’t know what you can do about that.
SPEAKER_1: But anything that you can do would be super awesome.

SPEAKER_1: I mean, aside from the podcast that you’ve had in the past, all the work you’re doing at your practice, your Monday night events, your mastermind, like everything that you are already creating.

SPEAKER_2: I’m just going to add that to the to-do list.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, just tell your husband there’s one more thing we’re going to add to the list.

SPEAKER_2: We know that any kind of cultural revolution, whether it was about race or LGBT rights or any of these things, they take some time, but they’re doable.

SPEAKER_2: I know that there are people that still say we haven’t come far enough in the terms of race and LGBT rights, but it’s a long ways away from where we were.

SPEAKER_2: I’d like to see, maybe not for us, Cole, we’ll be in the old folks’ home, probably still singing and dancing and raising hell.

SPEAKER_1: I’m not going to an old folks’ home.
SPEAKER_2: Well, it’s going to be our yurts.
SPEAKER_2: It’s going to be our glamour yurts out in the commune. SPEAKER_1: It’s going to be the commune.

SPEAKER_2: When we’re doing that and we’re looking at the Gen Zs that we’ve raised and we said, okay, now we’ve started it, just like all Gen Xers, we started Google, we started Napster, which doesn’t exist anymore.

SPEAKER_2: We started Apple, really.
SPEAKER_2: I think we started Amazon. SPEAKER_2: You guys are going to take it. SPEAKER_2: We’re going to hand it off, the 440 relay.

SPEAKER_2: We’re handing the stick to you.

SPEAKER_2: Now you run it with it.

SPEAKER_2: I think the Gen Z generation is really going to surprise us.

SPEAKER_2: I think they’re the next Gen X in terms of they’re kind of quiet and silent, but they have thoughts.

SPEAKER_1: They’re friggin amazing. SPEAKER_1: I mean, they are so amazing. SPEAKER_1: So my son, Luke, is a Gen Z.

SPEAKER_1: And I have learned so much, like I tell everybody now, he’s one of my greatest teachers, because these people, this generation, they see the world so differently, and they’re already transforming work.

SPEAKER_1: They’re transforming like what success means. SPEAKER_1: They’re not buying homes.
SPEAKER_1: Some of them just can’t afford them.

SPEAKER_1: But the things that I think were particularly important and ingrained in us, like I call it the big lie, Heather, where we were told, you go to high school, you go to college, you choose a job, you get married, you suck it up at the job, suck it up through the marriage, like whatever it is, there’s none of that for these people.

SPEAKER_1: They’re like, nope, you know what, life for me is about living.

SPEAKER_1: They have very strong opinions and positions on a lot of the global situations that we are all experiencing right now as a human species.

SPEAKER_1: So I would be so happy and proud to pass that gold like diamond studded baton to any of the women in the Gen Z group because they will run with it and they will do something magical with it.

SPEAKER_2: The spirit stick.
SPEAKER_2: Take it, sisters.
SPEAKER_1: The spirit stick.
SPEAKER_2: Give us a few more minutes of it and then we’re going to hand it off to the next group.

SPEAKER_1: Exactly.

SPEAKER_1: We’re going to bless it and then we’re going to hand it off from the commune.

SPEAKER_2: Don’t drop it.

SPEAKER_2: I think that we were the only generation to make that generation.

SPEAKER_2: You know, I mean, I know probably there’s women that are Gen Xers or late boomers that have millennial kids.

SPEAKER_2: But for the most part, I think these Gen Zers are kind of an anti-generation, kind of like we were.

SPEAKER_1: Yeah.

SPEAKER_2: They’re ragers.

SPEAKER_2: They’re disruptors.

SPEAKER_1: They are major disruptors, like in the best way.

SPEAKER_1: And I will tell you, in my experience, one of the most compassionate generations I’ve ever met.

SPEAKER_2: Yeah. SPEAKER_1: That’s true.

SPEAKER_1: So what do you know that women don’t know about menopause because they’re not getting the information from their physicians?

SPEAKER_1: Like what are like, hit me with the one, two, three punch here.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, gosh.
SPEAKER_2: Okay.
SPEAKER_2: What we don’t know, one is that everyone’s going to go through it.
SPEAKER_2: Every single one of those plants going to go through it.
SPEAKER_2: It’s supposed to be one billion women in menopause, I think by 2025 in around the world. SPEAKER_2: Everyone goes through it, if you’re lucky.

SPEAKER_2: You know, the other option is that you didn’t make it, you know.

SPEAKER_2: So everyone goes through it.

SPEAKER_2: So it’s natural.

SPEAKER_2: Two is that there is a lot of information out there and a lot of good information if you’re willing to go look for it.

SPEAKER_2: You know, right now it’s unfortunately we can’t spoon feed it all, but there’s a bunch of us on TikTok or Instagram or other places that are trying to give out valid medical information.

SPEAKER_2: It’s hard to really give out medical advice because technically we’re not supposed to do that, but we’ll try to kind of do stuff with ourselves or whatever.

SPEAKER_2: And so I highly recommend people follow some of these different doctors out there because you can get a lot of information without even having to pay for it.

SPEAKER_2: And then three I would say is you got to find your tribe and that tribe includes besides just your sisters that you hang out with, it also needs to include a great, a great hair person.

SPEAKER_2: You got to have a great hair person, right?
SPEAKER_2: Because what I want to do, if you want to go gray, go gray, but have a gray hair person.

SPEAKER_2: If you want to grow more, all those things that your hair person, you always have a great hair person and a great provider, a great doctor that listens and takes the time.

SPEAKER_2: You know, I always kind of, my nurse is always knocking on the door saying, you’re like four people behind because I talk too much.

SPEAKER_1: And that is why that you have four people waiting behind every one woman that you’re helping, right?

SPEAKER_2: Well, they, you know, they all patiently wait because they know that I’m probably blabbing off in some room about something.

SPEAKER_2: I’m on some soapbox about something.
SPEAKER_2: But you know, but I always say, you know, insurance doesn’t pay me to get to that point. SPEAKER_2: And so I would say, just be patient, find the right provider, book it out if you have to.

SPEAKER_2: In the meantime, follow these people on Instagram and TikTok and YouTube and all these different places because there are really good people out there that are talking about this.

SPEAKER_2: And then find your find your icon. SPEAKER_2: Who’s your icon?
SPEAKER_2: Put it up on your screen saver at work. SPEAKER_2: It could be a collage.

SPEAKER_2: It could be a fun project.

SPEAKER_1: And by the way, your icon could be you, right?

SPEAKER_2: Would that be weird?

SPEAKER_2: I don’t know.

SPEAKER_2: I could be me.


SPEAKER_2: What I would do is I would put a collage and then I would probably like put me in the middle.

SPEAKER_1: Exactly.
SPEAKER_2: When I went to go to medical school, I had a collage that I made.

SPEAKER_2: And so 20 something, I was driving, I took a picture of a BMW because I thought that was the car to get, you know, when you’re a doctor.

SPEAKER_2: You know, I was like, I wasn’t in a med school. SPEAKER_2: It was the, it was the, you know, 90s.

SPEAKER_2: I had this BMW picture and I glued my face, a picture of my face in the driver’s seat because this is before we had better computers.

SPEAKER_2: I had to glue it.
SPEAKER_2: Right.
SPEAKER_2: And then I took a picture of Noah Wiley, who was in the ER show at the time. SPEAKER_2: And I found a picture where he’s looking over to the side.
SPEAKER_2: So he’s, I glued his face looking at me in the driver’s seat.

SPEAKER_2: And I had that shit up for a long time because I was like, Oh, yeah, it was like my vision board.

SPEAKER_2: And so I might put myself in the group of amazing women.

SPEAKER_2: Like I might put like, you know, Angela Bassett, Viola Davis, Michelle Yeoh, Cher, whoever you want to put in there.

SPEAKER_2: And then I might put me like right in the middle, like those Vanity Fair shoots they do every year with the big group of women.

SPEAKER_2: But I’ll put my face over like someone else’s evening gown because otherwise I’ll just be like in some sweats or something.

SPEAKER_1: I think that everybody, every single woman on this planet should have themselves like on their own list of icons because we all have the power to be that if we just believe that we are that, right?

SPEAKER_1: So it’s like we all have this authentic badassery and I think too many of us just don’t take the time to find it.

SPEAKER_1: So I’m going to encourage you to make another vision board and put yourself right in the middle.

SPEAKER_2: I’m doing it.
SPEAKER_2: But I’m not doing a BMW anymore.
SPEAKER_2: That shit’s old.
SPEAKER_2: I’m over cars.
SPEAKER_2: That ended by the 30.
SPEAKER_2: I was like, I don’t need a BMW.
SPEAKER_2: I don’t need that for it’s just more gas stuff and everything. SPEAKER_2: So I’ll find a new place to put me.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, that sounds good.
SPEAKER_1: All right, babe.

SPEAKER_1: So let’s break down this last expert question down into two groups, women who are less than 40 and women who are half time show.

SPEAKER_1: So what three of your most favorite game changing tips can you share to help women turn this whole chapter, this whole half time show into a big ass celebration of life and become their most fire selves?

SPEAKER_2: That’s like six things because I got three tips.

SPEAKER_2: I got to bring a younger 40 and then the half time technically, yes, it’s six, but it’s three, three for each group.

SPEAKER_2: It’s really going to be okay.

SPEAKER_2: My first one’s going to be for both groups, which is again, find your group, find your icons.

SPEAKER_2: So if you’re 30, look at your women 40 plus.
SPEAKER_2: Don’t just look at Kardashians or the K-pop girls and all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_2: It’s really, I can’t wait to see what the K-pop people think about menopause because they’re going to really struggle because they are so youth obsessed.

SPEAKER_2: They are so obsessed about all that stuff.
SPEAKER_2: So it’s fine.
SPEAKER_2: Find the tribe 10 years plus from wherever you are, wherever you are.
SPEAKER_2: If you’re 30, find the 40 year olds.
SPEAKER_2: If you’re 40, find the 50 year olds.
SPEAKER_2: If you’re 50 plus, find the 60, 70 year olds and make your little group, right? SPEAKER_2: And mine changes a lot.
SPEAKER_2: Whenever I see a woman, I’m like, oh, it’s a fun game to play with your friends actually.

SPEAKER_2: Who would be on your list?
SPEAKER_2: Top five people.
SPEAKER_2: You know, like, and just, and just name them actually.
SPEAKER_2: And why?
SPEAKER_2: Are they smart and sexy?

SPEAKER_2: Are they just pure lust?

SPEAKER_2: Are they pure just like, you know, what, what is it about them that makes them so attractive to you?

SPEAKER_2: Because it’s kind of girl crushing.

SPEAKER_2: It’s a girl crush.

SPEAKER_2: You want to find your girl crushes, right?

SPEAKER_2: So that would be the first thing I would say is, is find whoever these are and follow them, you know, follow them or just, you know, put something up about them and see what they do.

SPEAKER_2: And two is it’s definitely to educate yourself.

SPEAKER_2: You’re going to have to do a lot of this on your own because, you know, chances are good that, you know, when you go to a medical office, there’s not time to really sit down and educate all the basics.

SPEAKER_2: You know, educate yourself, find the information about it.

SPEAKER_2: There’s the Menopause Society.

SPEAKER_2: There’s, you know, like I said, there’s some great doctors on TikTok and Instagram.

SPEAKER_2: Find the information and start discerning for yourself what’s going to work for you.

SPEAKER_2: So discernment is a big one, but it’s really what is good for you, Cole versus me, Heather.

SPEAKER_2: Like, oh, I know I don’t want to take any hormones or I can’t because my mom had breast cancer or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_2: Just kind of start making your little checklist of what you want to do and three, stay on top of it.

SPEAKER_2: So don’t wait two years.

SPEAKER_2: I have women that have been miserable for two years before they came and see me and they just start bawling in the office and this is why I go through boxes and boxes of Kleenex every day.

SPEAKER_2: And I’m like, I’m so sorry.
SPEAKER_2: Let’s figure out how to fix this. SPEAKER_2: So perimenopause can start as early as 30.

SPEAKER_2: So it’s not out of the realm because the normal age of menopause is 40 to 60. SPEAKER_2: So 10 years before could be 30.

SPEAKER_2: So if you’re not sure, it’s best to check out symptoms, symptom checklist, kind of keep on top of it.

SPEAKER_2: Watch your periods, watch the moods, really start to track your health because then when it’s time you have, you’re not just feeling in the moment, but you’re actually have data and data speaks volumes to medical professionals, but also it can speak volumes to you because you’re like, wow, every month, a week before my period, I am a huge biatch.

SPEAKER_2: So what do I need to do?

SPEAKER_2: Is it whether more magnesium or is it do I need to be on a birth control pill?

SPEAKER_2: Not always my favorite thing, but some women want that because it’s cheap.

SPEAKER_2: What do we need to do?

SPEAKER_2: More progesterone and start kind of researching it yourself so you have your own blueprint, your own map before you get there.

SPEAKER_2: Do you want to map out your trip before you’re on the trip versus while you’re on the trip? SPEAKER_1: Yep.
SPEAKER_1: Got it.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, cool.

SPEAKER_1: So I kind of lied because I have one more question that just popped up for me as you were talking about the hormones.

SPEAKER_1: So there is a very long held belief that once women hit the half time show that there’s no more sex, that sex is bad, it’s terrible, it’s miserable.

SPEAKER_1: What would you have to say about that?
SPEAKER_2: Oh, wow, I think it’s actually the best time for sex ever. SPEAKER_2: And I want to go back to the no bleeding, no breathing.

SPEAKER_2: And you and I live in states where I believe there’s some access to things that there was an oops that is limited.

SPEAKER_2: So I tell them and I’m like, you know, 40, 45, you could still get pregnant.

SPEAKER_2: You know, so when you’re at the half time show, you don’t worry about any of that anymore.

SPEAKER_2: You can have sex whenever you want.

SPEAKER_2: There’s not a week or every month, which was 12 weeks a year.

SPEAKER_2: You can’t have sex.

SPEAKER_2: You can’t have sex whenever because you’re never bleeding.

SPEAKER_2: So to me, it really opens up the portal to an amazing sex life.

SPEAKER_2: Now granted, I will say this, that the men do go through what they call andropause.

SPEAKER_2: I like to call it manopause because I think I’m clever, but it’s andropause, which is like, why aren’t they the menopause and we’re something else?

SPEAKER_2: But it’s a very similar process. SPEAKER_2: And that’s when they get the dad bod.

SPEAKER_2: You know, we all say the dad bod and they, although I’m not like pro man, but I’m saying they don’t have an equivalent to menopause specialists.

SPEAKER_2: The guys don’t have that.
SPEAKER_2: They will go to their PCP.
SPEAKER_2: They’ll say, oh, yeah, here’s some Viagra.
SPEAKER_2: Go away.
SPEAKER_2: I don’t want to see you.
SPEAKER_2: They don’t have a urologist that does, you know, holistic integrated urology. SPEAKER_2: They don’t make them.
SPEAKER_2: They don’t exist.
SPEAKER_2: And they usually will send them going to these testosterone centers in a strip club. SPEAKER_2: Strip, wrong word.

SPEAKER_2: That will happen too.
SPEAKER_1: Then to the strip club.
SPEAKER_1: Strip, then to the strip club.
SPEAKER_2: Mall, and then they go to the strip club. SPEAKER_2: And so they really don’t have a tribe, a community. SPEAKER_2: They don’t have any of this stuff.

SPEAKER_2: And so I say, when you look at the men in your life, give them a little bit of credit. SPEAKER_2: They need a little bit of something too, because they go through a very similar process. SPEAKER_2: It’s not as significant.
SPEAKER_2: And it’s more subtle.

SPEAKER_2: And it’s more kind of like they don’t really have like the moment where they don’t have periods anymore.

SPEAKER_2: You know, it’s like they don’t have that.

SPEAKER_2: They just all of a sudden look down one day and they’re tired.

SPEAKER_2: They have some man boobs, they have a dad bod, and they can’t get it up anymore.

SPEAKER_2: And they just kind of figure that’s just getting older.

SPEAKER_2: You know, it’s the Archie Bunker thing.

SPEAKER_2: It’s going to go sit in the recliner and, you know, watch TV all day.

SPEAKER_2: So they go through something very similar.

SPEAKER_2: And so if the guy in your life is also experiencing that, if there’s a man in your life, then it’s worthwhile getting him some help too, because it’s great to have a great sex life by yourself.

SPEAKER_2: And I have a lot of women that do that.
SPEAKER_2: They have a lot of fun toys.
SPEAKER_2: But if you want your partner to be part of it too, then you may have to get them some help.

SPEAKER_2: And we all know how men are with health care.

SPEAKER_2: You’re going to probably have to make the appointment yourself and drive them.

SPEAKER_2: And get them ice cream afterwards, damn it.

SPEAKER_1: Get them some ice cream afterwards.

SPEAKER_1: And so I think, you know, an underlying point here is compassion, communication.

SPEAKER_1: Because I’m telling you, Heather, like this is the midlife crisis.

SPEAKER_1: This is why people get divorced, they have affairs, they, you know, leave the country.

SPEAKER_1: They just ditch their careers, like whatever.

SPEAKER_1: I think that lack of communication is a really important component to all of those things.

SPEAKER_1: So I really appreciate you bringing up the term andropause.

SPEAKER_1: My husband and I have talked about it before and he’s like, what?

SPEAKER_1: Nobody ever told me that.

SPEAKER_1: I was like, yeah, it’s a fact, babe.

SPEAKER_1: Andropause is real.

SPEAKER_1: And it’s kind of funny because his name is Andrew.

SPEAKER_1: And so it kind of fits.

SPEAKER_1: All right.

SPEAKER_1: So before we scoot, because I am so grateful that you swung by today.

SPEAKER_1: I love you.

SPEAKER_1: And incidentally, this could not have been a more perfect day for us to record because it is Solar Eclipse Day 2024, will not have another one until 2044.

SPEAKER_1: And so I feel like all of this energy and this hope around this particular conversation that we can really send this out into the world and have women just remember that they are beautiful, divine artists, these sacred creators, as you call them, and, you know, approach all of this whole half time show much differently because there is so much to be gained.

SPEAKER_1: There is so much to be gained.

SPEAKER_1: You know that, I know that, many badass women out there know that.

SPEAKER_1: So thank you.

SPEAKER_1: Do you have any happenings that are coming up?

SPEAKER_1: Anything big for you that you’d like to share with the folks before we part ways for today?

SPEAKER_2: Oh, yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_2: Well, since you brought it up, sex and menopause.

SPEAKER_2: Our free Monday webinar is coming up on the 20th, oh my gosh, the last Monday, April 29th.

SPEAKER_2: And the woman that’s joining me for this one is Kim Holden, who is an intimacy coach. SPEAKER_2: She’s about 60 this year, breast cancer survivor, and she trains, doms, subs. SPEAKER_2: She’s got a fantastic freaking sex life.
SPEAKER_2: She’s like the cool aunt you always wanted.

SPEAKER_2: And so she and I are going to have a conversation about sex and menopause.

SPEAKER_2: And if they go to just, they can get into the list to get on the email list and we’ll be sending out registration for that.

SPEAKER_2: It’s free, totally free.

SPEAKER_1: That’s awesome.

SPEAKER_1: And so can women sign up for your mastermind there as well on Menopause Rocks?

SPEAKER_2: So on the website, there’s a whole thing about just kind of the different options and then how to book with me and all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_2: So yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_2: And we’ll be releasing that course, I’m hoping by June 1st, all about the intro to menopause and navigating the menopause map.

SPEAKER_1: That’s awesome.

SPEAKER_1: That’s awesome.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_1: And before we part, you do offer tele health for women, yes?

SPEAKER_1: I do.


SPEAKER_2: We do.

SPEAKER_1: All right.

SPEAKER_1: So women, if you’re listening to and thinking to yourself right now, oh my god, I wish this woman was my doctor.

SPEAKER_1: It can be true.

SPEAKER_1: I will be sure to put your website links in the show notes, Dr.

SPEAKER_1: Heather, so everybody can find you.

SPEAKER_1: And again, thank you so much for the work you’re doing to empower so many women, to educate so many women, and for sharing so much of your badass expertise right here.

SPEAKER_1: I just absolutely freaking love you! You’re amazing.
SPEAKER_2: Likewise.
SPEAKER_1: I love you too.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you, babe.

SPEAKER_1: All right, Amazing Ones, if you’re ready to develop a mindset of confidence and clarity to live your most authentic and rewarding life, I’d love to meet you and help you get there.

SPEAKER_1: Head to the contact form on my website,

SPEAKER_1: Tell me what’s on your mind.
SPEAKER_1: Let’s talk about what’s possible for you together.

SPEAKER_1: And remember, babe, there’s only one you.

SPEAKER_1: In case no one’s told you yet today, that is what makes you amazing.

SPEAKER_1: Big love to you!

SPEAKER_1: See you next week.

SPEAKER_1: And that’s the end of the show today, everybody.

SPEAKER_1: I hope it has served you well.

SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much for tuning in.

SPEAKER_1: If you’ve liked what you’ve heard, please drop a review wherever you grab your favorite podcast.

SPEAKER_1: Please subscribe so you never miss an episode.
SPEAKER_1: And please be sure to share this podcast with another woman that you love.

SPEAKER_1: If you’d like to learn more about me or my work, check out my website,

SPEAKER_1: Until next time, remember to be super kind to yourself and do your very best to leave everyone and everything just a little bit better.

Learn about Menopause Rocks and Dr. Heather’s monthly webinar series

Follow Dr. Heather on social media @drheatherbartos

Resources Cited: Tough Titties By Laura Bell Gray

If you’re ready to develop a mindset of confidence and clarity that will help you live your most authentic and rewarding life, I’d love to meet you. Send me a note  and tell me what’s on your mind. Let’s explore what’s possible for your life through mindfulness based life coaching.